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Is it fair to call Warcraft A Tolkein Copy pasta/Cliche ?

Discussion in 'Lordaeron: The Foremath' started by Spectator, Jun 6, 2018.

  1. Zlade(PinkArcher)
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    Zlade(PinkArcher)

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    Humans (real life) have been known to take things around them and improve them in their own image. Trees into tree houses, the wood around them into houses, it is no different with fantasy content. We see great things and become inspired we draw upon these inspirations and improve them in our own image. Some of these become legends like Warcraft, some of them forgotten with time or are never great to begin with. It is ok to draw inspiration and make your own story, warcraft is no way a direct copy pasta from one source and that is ok. There is a difference between cloning and drawing from inspiration. Warcraft has drawn from inspiration and is no clone.
  2. Aolfien
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    Aolfien I am also lukasborec Brigand

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    Warcraft was always awesome, because it took itself only 85% seriously. It had an amazing lore, sure, but you could feel the fun the creators had with creating the story.
    It's funny, because WoW has much shittier lore and yet it takes itself much more seriously than War3.
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  3. Elbadruhel
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    Elbadruhel

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    Much more seriously? Really?

    https://wow.gamepedia.com/Johnny_Awesome

    Wow still has w3 stupid easter eggs around there, the difference is WoW is HUGE, so u need to explore a lot to find those gems. And nowadays in Wow most players just tp from here to there with dungeon finder, bg finder, etc. In the good old days u had to move to everywhere, finding stuff in ur trips, discovering lore and regions.

    I still remember when i was young and found Gilneas locked in Vanilla/TBC... I had fun with some friends just trying to discover what the hell whas thar, or how to pass trough. And repeat that same thing in other places, and in some of them, found a hidden house, NPC or somehting. Like in the kids house in the mountains of Dalaran, did the witch ate them all? o_O

    W3 was more straight forward, mision, map, mision, map. And with a simple "iseedeadpeople" u could check whole map for easter eggs.
  4. Aolfien
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    Aolfien I am also lukasborec Brigand

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    I am not saying that WoW has shitty lore altogether, I am just saying that the MAIN STORY of the game is just weird now. I'll never forgive Blizzard for butchering the lore with Warlords of Draenor.
    There are some amazing little stories in World of Warcraft and the game itself is indeed magical, because of the beatiful music and atmosphere, but the main direction of the lore is just weak.
    I'd prefer WoW to be a game where you could explore the world, settle all these little conflicts and explore all the stories the world has to offer BUT
    the main direction of the lore should be directed by strategy genre :-/
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  5. Elbadruhel
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    Elbadruhel

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    Well, i agree with u that WoD was shit. Garrosh story should have ended with his defeat in mist of pandaria. But i think blizzard felt they needed more cool orichs characters, and the only way to bring more "orcish" stuff was to go to their world before it was shattered, and to do that... U need time travel. Also, grommash was a GREAT character in lore, but he never appeared in Wow, so again, time traveling was "needed" to show him to average player.

    But well, u can simply forget WoD and just enjoy the lore.
  6. Aolfien
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    Aolfien I am also lukasborec Brigand

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    Ye, that's probably the best approach :D
  7. Spectator
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    Spectator Adapt or Die Donator

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    WoW lore is not absolute trash but compared to Warcraft it will always be quite trash. The reasoning is simple, We The characters ruin everything. It's impossible to write a good story when you have bunch of overpowered Mary sues and Gay Stues in your story who cannot lose or die.

    In Warcraft the story was the in game Character's perspective, you would get to know how they feel while it being impossible to predict what is gonna happen next.

    In WoW you are from your own perspective and there is nothing interesting about that unless you are into extreme RP. So basically It was kinda insulting to see Characters Like Kael'thas be turned just mindless main bosses and die to bunch of scrubs behind keyboards for loot. It was like spitting on Warcraft lore entirely since you saw a character rise up through from his lowest in Warcraft 3 and evolve and the in end it all meant nothing in WoW. Same thing keeps happening over and over in WoW. Mary sues keeping beating any Evil that rises while there is no more factions other than Horde and Alliance who can never actually hurt each other.

    This is why I reckon for movies and stories or maybe follow up on Warcraft, WOW should be fully considered non-cannon. Simply cause story wise it's garbage.
  8. Equinox
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    Equinox

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    They didn't "copy" anything from Tolkien. Well, in its purist form, they did, but all artists 'copy' from one another.. The plain, SIMPLE fact, is that Tolkien created the modern english myth. An unparalleled measure, and it is highly regarded, deviations from this are as expected and welcomed as deviations of a romantic romeo x juliet story. People need to get past their own gripes and realize, that within their minds, they foresee this as familiar and that does not make it bad or counter intuitive towards creative storytelling.

    All of the knowledge and feelings Tolkien encapsulated was not out of nowhere. We all knew and had those memories as well as drawing towards what he captured, but he merely put it into word and people were swayed by it as they would be by any piece of literature or better yet history/mythology. Elves, Dwarves, and Orcs aren't Tolkien's, even though he created them. They're everyones at this point.
  9. Elbadruhel
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    Elbadruhel

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    Elves, orcs, demons, ogres, giants, ghosts, spirits... All of them have existed in human mithology from thousands years. Writers just pick those stories as inspiration. Tolkien did so, and also inspired in modern times to update those ancient myths, like Saruman with industrialization of the white guys that should use their power to help but instead use it to corrupt nature and get power, or Haradrim and Umbar with mean black people and arabs that attack those that gave them culture and tech in the past.

    All new stories ofc will share something with Tolkien. Its normal, we are humans, we share myths. God, even most ancient mythologies have similar gods: thunder, life, fire, dead, wisdom, etc
  10. Draupne
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    Draupne Won't get any more fun than what you make yourself Brigand Map Maker

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    Warcraft lore has developed in the same route as Superhero comics usually do over time. In the 80s, Superman transitioned from being able to throw cars and jump over buildings to lift meteors and fight gods. You can try as hard as you want; NOTHING is interesting about over-the-top story elements. Time travel, killing gods and titans, demonic spaceship warfare, planetary teleportation, giant crystal swords... all of this flamboyant maximalist shit that the Warcraft universe has turned into really pulls away from the appeal it had back when it was still humble. This is EXACTLY why we map makers continue to make maps about Lordaeron's descent into darkness, the Plaguelands civil war, the undead campaign against Dalaran and Quel'thalas... these parts of Warcraft dealt with characters that were not some god or otherwordly interterrestial being. They were characters that had to make high stake decisions. Grom, Arthas, Thrall, Sylvanas... all of these characters ain't nothing like they used to.
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