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LTF Balance and the fix! (long promised thread)

Discussion in 'Lordaeron: The Foremath' started by Spectator, Jul 21, 2017.

  1. Spectator
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    Spectator Adapt or Die Donator

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    When it came to walls of Text. There was only one Person to learn from :D. Tho idk why i constantly get this feeling Emperor is purposely holding back for us fresh wall of texters to get fully over-confident so then he can Unleash his FULL POWER!
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  2. TheKaldorei
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    TheKaldorei High Priestess of Elune Shaman Map Maker

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    buff fireball and am i right
  3. Spectator
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    Spectator Adapt or Die Donator

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    I tell anyone who says that to me! play dalaran against my OJ and you ll see what needs buff...
  4. TheKaldorei
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    TheKaldorei High Priestess of Elune Shaman Map Maker

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    that post was sarcastic

    FIREBALL DOESNT NEED A BUFF ARE YOU INSANE
    ???
  5. Onyx
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    Onyx GrimmHeart Darksbane

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    Insane is not the exact word, "dumb" fits better here
  6. Spectator
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    lol so was mine indicating the game balance is lot more complicated than what you think and one liners are for trolls that never solve shit. Balancing is not as simple as just buff/nerf fireball...

    Plus I don't ever recall saying fireball needs buff so don't put words in my mouth please.
  7. Onyx
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    Onyx GrimmHeart Darksbane

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    Nahhhhhhhhhhh of course, but you'd really Fireball to one shot Pit lords as well as any other unit don't you ?
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  8. Spectator
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    not 100% sure what you trying to say.

    but no i don't want fireball to one shot pitlords. Right now it only does 20% of their HP at best and guess what?? Legion team can 8 fking Pitlords...

    I just don't understand why so much focus on fireball and dalaran meanwhile Orange is 3 times stronger than dalaran if not more.

    Magtherdons ulti makes Each AA look like fireball while his natural Fire ability is basically fireball with much longer AoE. Rend's ultimate is also Garroh's ultimate which is army wipe. Look I am not gonna go through and show fking OP OJ as faction and overall legion team is.

    But I'm gonna say this, An OP Legion team is the worst thing that can happen as unlike Lich King, Alliance or Neutrals. Legion team is absolute filled with noob factions.

    Anyone can legit play LTF 2-3 times and be god at Playing OJ and shadow council, then they can play another 2-3 times and be god at Teal and Dragonmaw.

    Legion team requires no strategy. Just one objective: Push from south to North while being met with no resistance. Nor playing hero squad faction like OJ takes much skill either. There is not like much difference between experienced OJ player and normal ones.


    Now this ruins games in current patch like it did in 0.07 cause the OPiest faction can legit be utilized by anyone who has rarely touched WC3 or LTF. So you can't even balance the game by putting the noobier players on the OP factions...

    At least in 0.14 when alliance was a bit stronger, it would legit take a lot of experience and skill for alliance players to pull of the 6v6 win. The strategy/coordination and starting rotations for alliance were damn complex unlike legions... So you could put the less skilled players on alliance and sort of have a balanced game.

    edit: Not saying total noob factions like Legions are bad, its just they are really bad when they are OP cause u can't balance a lobby around it...
  9. Elbadruhel
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    Elbadruhel

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    I use to play as blue or legion, and the opiest thing i have ever seen is: dalaran or rangers. Its imposible to reach them and they destroy u from afar. I think there must be some evil faction designed to chase and kill easily running rangers, but not blue at all, u cant do a shit vs them, just see ur army die.

    Maybe Orange is strong in some situations, or Legion or whatever u say, but the point is dont find a faction that has "strong points", but a faction that doesnt have "weak points". All factions need to have a counter so they can be defeated, that means balance.

    If there will be no one able to reach those fucking rangers that delete u from afar and if u try to hit them they run and continue harrasing... They will be broken. But if there is a faction that can manage to hunt them down, it doesnt matter that rangers are strong and op vs blue, because other can counter them. That makes strategy important and allows teamwork, what is cool.

    So stop discusing about if this faction is strong or not, because u all surely will talk about the strenght of ur usual enemies, and start talking about the counters u think that are ingame for those strong points that other people is saying about a faction.

    For example, if someone says: fireball is op. Dont say: orange is op too!. No, say: u can counter it with magic shield. (for example). So we can reach a point with this conversation, and dont just repeat the same things once and again :D.

    (Just an advice :p)

    Greetings!
  10. Spectator
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    Good point! However don't forget you gotta see teams! not Factions!!

    For example Right now Legion team is OP period! Evil can beat alliance easily in the 6v6 and then in civil War Legion Team always comes out on TOP! simple!

    that is why apart from legion team, when someone suggests a nerf on other teams i always want to explain them the situation and tell its ok to nerf that team particular ability. For example fireball in this case but suggest something that can help them in later game cause right now alliance is struggling hard.

    The Hard part of balance is balancing the power between Teams! For example right now shadow council or Risen or fel elves are relatively weak factions. However I will disagree if someone suggests buffing them cause right now Legion Team is OP. any buffs to them will make legion team more OP.

    So when it comes to viewing a single factions balance Don't look the faction only! look at their Team then give your suggestion. For example if you want shadow council to get buffed say look Shadow council sucks to play i feel useless as hell with no impact, can we please nerf Legion team's OP members like Orange or blackdragon flight and give some of their power to shadow council? same thing can be applied to nerfing an OP mechanic like Fireball or Skybreaker.

    edit: i know it will be harder for most people since they have not played every faction path couple of times and are not full on nerds like me. They just sad their main faction sucks but just please try to understand where i am coming from by disagreeing with you.



    Just about Rangers @Elbadruhel Ik your pain. It fking sucks fighting them As Blue. Your melee is too slow to get to their back line. Your siege don't do much do them cause of medium armor and their AoE blows up ur siege easily. Your Frost wyrms are shit against archers with Elunes grace and medium armor. and worst of all you have hard time dispelling treant and Arance minion summons cause only form of dispell u have is the useless ones on Nerubian seers which are quite hard and expensive to get.

    HOWEVER! This where your ally cult comes in, Cult can easily rekt Rangers by mass summoning on them. Also pretty good against dalaran too as usually dalaran runs out of mana dispelling all the summons. Also destroyers are pretty powerfull against dalaran.

    Now don't get me wrong tho, obviously in the current meta its a 2v5 for scourge during plague so u always should expect ur ass handed to you as Blue/cult in plague against good alliance. After you rekt in plague lands go group with Orcs and legion and push as 6! then you will be unstoppable! I know @Marshmalo will not happy with me encouraging Blue and Cult to group with Orcs and Legion team after being rekt during plague As this reduces their chance in civil war. But sorry @Marshmalo this is how the meta currently is! You are gonna lose the civil War anyways as blue/cult since your early game start is terrible as blue/cult being 2v5 while legion gets free south 4v1. While also Your Late game is rubbish in comparison to legion team. Overrall legion outpowers you heavily in every aspect during civil war.

    So best thing to do as blue/cult is to at least have the joy of killing alliance by grouping with Orcs since you are gonna lose the civil war anyways. At least you can say yay we won as Evil team and leave game like most people do...